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Old 12-20-2007, 04:42 PM
KevinStecyk KevinStecyk is offline
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Copyright

The following article is from NY Times, free registration might be required.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/12/20/te...=1&oref=slogin

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In an auditorium of 500, no matter how far my questions went down that garden path, maybe two hands went up. I just could not find a spot on the spectrum that would trigger these kids' morality alarm. They listened to each example, looking at me like I was nuts.

  

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Old 12-20-2007, 05:45 PM
PhilipKach PhilipKach is offline
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Re: Copyright

That is why I think the smarter photographers will use a business model that makes money regardless of copyright theft.

The law is on our side but technology and people's morality are on the other side.

Philip

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Old 12-20-2007, 07:09 PM
Will_Mass Will_Mass is offline
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Re: Copyright

As an event (horse show) photographer that shoots on spec, this is something I've considered at length. I know, like we all do, image theft goes on. In the past I've justified it by figuring: A) Every business has to deal with theft/bad debt/etc. on some level, and they build it into the price. B) As long as I've been able to make a living doing this, there's only so much I can do and I'll go nuts trying to stop it.

Then there's situations like this actual e-mail I received the other day:

"About two years ago I had a pony that I showed at the XXX series. There is a picture that I printed out from one of the shows, but she died a year ago and I really want to buy that picture! The problem is, I am not sure what year it was although I am pretty sure that it was 2005. Also, I don’t know which XXX show it was. I think it was the first or second of the year, but I am not sure. Can you help me?"

Interestingly, the rider's e-mail originated from a religious school. I was tempted to ask her about the concept of stealing and how that might fit with her education.

Philip has it right. The net is the Wild West, and it's not just the kids who think stealing our work is OK. We need to get paid to take the photos.
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Old 12-20-2007, 07:25 PM
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Noel_Carboni Noel_Carboni is offline
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Re: Copyright

The problem is people aren't teaching their children that stealing is wrong, in any form!

There's a lot of actual free software on the 'net. That's great. But we know that not all data is free; some of us make a livelihood selling data/images/information. Make it perfectly clear on every page you show that what you're showing is not free for the taking. Speak in plain terms.

My son wants to "Jailbreak" his iPhone. I told him, "No way." "But it's just to download some free games". I said, "You want to keep that thing and you want me to keep paying for it, you'll leave it alone. Mess with it and it'll be history in a heartbeat."

No exceptions. If it's gray area, consider it still wrong.

Talk to your kids about right and wrong, and actually show them when you buy software, images, or whatever data. And live the concept yourself; they'll learn by example. The problem will be less bad for the next generation if we teach them right from wrong.

The world is what we make of it.

-Noel
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Old 12-20-2007, 08:21 PM
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Dennis_Vied Dennis_Vied is offline
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Re: Copyright

Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_Mass View Post

Then there's situations like this actual e-mail I received the other day:

"About two years ago I had a pony that I showed at the XXX series. There is a picture that I printed out from one of the shows, but she died a year ago and I really want to buy that picture! The problem is, I am not sure what year it was although I am pretty sure that it was 2005. Also, I don’t know which XXX show it was. I think it was the first or second of the year, but I am not sure. Can you help me?"
I guess I don't quite understand what the objection is to the e-mail. Is it that the person printed out the image, or that the person is offering to buy it? If that was one of my images, I'd be tempted to find out which image it was and offer it for sale.

It sounds like the person is offering to buy it. How can that be bad?
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Old 12-20-2007, 08:56 PM
Will_Mass Will_Mass is offline
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Re: Copyright

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dennis_Vied View Post
I guess I don't quite understand what the objection is to the e-mail. Is it that the person printed out the image, or that the person is offering to buy it? If that was one of my images, I'd be tempted to find out which image it was and offer it for sale.

It sounds like the person is offering to buy it. How can that be bad?

Buying the photo of course is not a bad thing, and I have offered to help the young lady.

However, PhotoReflect.com, who I use to display and sell online, disables the right mouse click. There are copyright warnings all over Photo Reflect, and my site as well. In order to "print out" a photo an individual must circumvent these measures, not hard to to, and ignore the warnings. To me this is like going to a store and sticking an item in your pocket. then when you get to the door and the alarm goes off, you continue out the door. That is, you stole it. You know you stole it. The system just told you you stole it, and you just don't care.

This is particularly bothersome when shooting on spec, and potential customers come to us and ask to be photographed. Then rather buy the photos they steal them off the web.

I'm thinking the free ride is nearly over.
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Old 12-21-2007, 01:58 AM
KevinStecyk KevinStecyk is offline
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Re: Copyright

Quote:
Originally Posted by Will_Mass View Post
Buying the photo of course is not a bad thing, and I have offered to help the young lady.

However, PhotoReflect.com, who I use to display and sell online, disables the right mouse click. There are copyright warnings all over Photo Reflect, and my site as well. In order to "print out" a photo an individual must circumvent these measures, not hard to to, and ignore the warnings. To me this is like going to a store and sticking an item in your pocket. then when you get to the door and the alarm goes off, you continue out the door. That is, you stole it. You know you stole it. The system just told you you stole it, and you just don't care.

This is particularly bothersome when shooting on spec, and potential customers come to us and ask to be photographed. Then rather buy the photos they steal them off the web.

I'm thinking the free ride is nearly over.
Will could you not watermark the shots prior to uploading to an online facility. Then if they chose to steal the shot, at least it is damaged goods. It's kind of like stealing a tv with a permanent sticker in the middle of screen.

Best regards,
Kevin
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