I may be fixin {southern slang for going to}, to get in over my head here. Not competitive with the 10mp 40D for image quality? I'm sure no expert, but all I have understood about IQ is that no one parameter controls IQ. I read somewhere that the human eye cannot discern the difference between 12 bit and 14 bit reliably.
Would someone more learned please explain to me why a 10mp 14 bit image is always going to have better image quality than a 12 bit 24mp?
I think if the true facts were known, the new 12 mp CMOS chip on the new Sony and Nikon cameras are pretty much the same. I think the same scenario will happen with the 24 mp chip. Dunno, guess we'll have to wait. The announcement does hint that we are far from through with the megapixel race though. Computer companies are gonna love all this new additional capacity that will be needed.
Everyone talks about the Nikon - Canon competition. I think Sony will be the one to watch. They have quietly, {by Canon / Nikon standards} advanced their products many times fold. Sony just announced two new cameras. The A350 is a 14 mp ccd sensor camera with a live view that really is "live", as there is no screen blackout via additional dedicated lcd sensor. The 922,000 pixel 3" lcd also tilts and pivots! Offered at a pricepoint that NO other camera manufacturer can currently match!
On several fronts I think we would have to give Sony the award for "new technology".
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
I have to suggest that the 'bit' debate is only an issue with some pros. At the point you make a print, the bits disappear in any printer except a few inkjets. Same with aRGB.
Sony makes the sensor for the Nikon D300 and I agree that Sony is a gorilla to contend with. Whenever I come across a 'pro wanabee' while working, the first question I get asked is how many mp my camera is. It's probably a guy thing. Size matters.
Personally I don't want or need 22 mp to make a great photo but I can sure see the marketing advantage for a camera like that priced under $1,000. We pros think that the camera mfgs care only about us, we're a small market compared to the wanabees. Sony has no strong ties to the pro market, so no risk of losing sales if they target the amateurs. Sony has the money and the power to make this very interesting.
Uncle Fred is knocking at your door. If you hear the knocking, you should put on your glasses.
Doug
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
I don't think sony can play with the pros, right now, but in the future, they'll be there. Pros are most useful as advertising targeted to the hobbyist and amateur market. There just ain't enough of us. Give it a few years though and I think sony will be knocking on our doors as well. (which is fine with me.)
I also like to believe the manufacturers won't go much above the current 22mp because of lens issues. Really, at some point this is just going to be/is ridiculous.
The camera I use in my studio is 10mp, {Carl Ziess lens} and has served well. I do not feel I need more mp here.
However, my latest endeavour is wildlife photography. I use a 400mm lens with 1.4 telel adapter = 560mm X 1.6 {camera factor} = 896mm effective and still have to crop on a lot of images. I found out one does not have to crop much from an image to all the sudden end up with an image with half the mp started out with. I feel like I need all the mp I can manage in this instance. I realize "wildlife photographers" are a very small percentage of total image takers.
I thought the mp race had calmed a bit, it's evident it has started back up.
I agree Sony is the "sleeping giant".
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
Looks like Sony is going to take a stab at a higher end model towards the end of the year, featuring this new chip. I'm going to keep my expectations low.
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
12 bit vs. 14 bit sensor readouts don't affect the entire image equally, as gamma correction is applied to the linear readings to produce the images we see. The differentiation between gray levels in the shadows is much more dependent on bit depth/data accuracy than the differentiation between levels in bright areas.
However, having more than double the number of pixels counts for something with regard to image quality. The real question is what's the accuracy and sensitivity? All we have heard is that the image quality of the Sony chip is going to be "high".
Sony or anyone will indeed find beating the image quality of "even the 40D" a challenge, but not just because of the bit depth. Canon has been steadily improving the systems surrounding their imager chips to eke out every possible bit of IQ. That kind of experience doesn't grow on silicon wafers.
Canon is already on something like its 5th generation of CMOS designs (and that's just counting 1.6x crop camera generations). 3 or 4 generations ago they beat the problem with long exposures, and in each new iteration something got better... By now the imagers are pretty darned good.
Is it possible Sony solved something that Canon hasn't been able to, by virtue of a completely different approach to CMOS imager design? CMOS, by the way, was discounted early on by most manufacturers as impossibly noisy, so most abandoned it while Canon forged ahead. Perhaps Sony has hired some folks who used to work for Canon. Any way you look at it, even though Sony is a force to be reckoned with, it is hard to imagine this chip will herald in any new era in imaging. Canon just has too much of a head start.
However, as a poster above mentioned, competition is GOOD - for us!
Having shot 20/30D and now 40D I can see the difference the extra 2 bits makes to the image quality, tonal gradation, and DR. I suppose the HTP function would be much less useful with a 12 bit limit as well.
A few years back one of the magazines did a test of the then-new 16mp 1Ds vs film in regards to the ability to resolve detail. 16 mp beat film. So what is the need for 24mp? Marketing hype mostly. Sure, some landscape guys will find it useful, but mostly it's a drag in speed and financially on everything else you do.
The 8mp/12 bit to 10mp/14 bit cost me money beyond the camera - bigger CF cards to be able to shoot the same frame count, more backup space due to the larger files, more backup time to burn DVDs as now I need 2 not 1. I know many a photog that disliked this side effect with the 5D - overkill for many (if not most) purposes.
Why do you think Sony is releasing so many dSLRs? $100 price difference between models? What is their plan over the next 2 to 3 years by doing this? Does Canon or Nikon need to respond, and how?
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
Linear Mode
