Hopefully this is familiar territory for somebody. I'm trying to come up with a workable solution.
How have you handled percentage take and costs when shooting an event with another "event" photographer. I'm gearing up for a big gig and have about 95% of the equipment needed. Have any of you come up with an acceptable (to both parties) way of putting a dollar value on bringing your setup to a gig?
ie. I have almost all of the equipment (10 viewing stations, processing computers and associated software, 3 dye sub printers, lighting and grip gear and all of their assorted carry cases) and we want to partner up for a number of events (other photog doesn't want a straight wage, but a percentage of the take and to become a partner in the business and do "his share" of the work)
Other photographer will provide all of his own shooting gear and a few "event" items such a large backdrop for group portraits and stands for same.
My first thought is to treat it similar to one approach people use when shooting a regular job for hire: Calculate what it would cost to rent the equipment needed to do the job and use that as a starting point--deduct it from the gross take. From there, I would think we could split percentages based on amount of participation or effort both pre and post event. Once the equipment issue is out of the picture, it would be a lot easier to justify a 50% split figure.
Any thoughts on this? I want to be fair.
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
I guess it would depend greatly on who generated the lead but it sounds to me that you are in more of a position to hire this, or some other person, rather than forming a partnership. You've gone through great expense to aquire your equipment, great time to devleop your workflow and when push comes to shove, you'll be the one to have to 'Fix' what breaks.
This business partner is benefiting greatly because he now has the means the increase his revenue from event shooting ten fold with out the large investment of stations, software and hardware.... Of course ten fold is an assumption but its resonable to think he stands to gain a lot more than you with little investment.
I know it doesn't exactly answer the "How much to offer" question but the jist of it is, don't sell yourself short. Unless this person is bringing more to the table, cut this person a flat rate.
-Jasen
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
We pitched the next event we're doing together...so it WILL be a partnership. I guess the first question is how to place a monetary value on the partnership's use of "the setup"--so everybody can agree ahead of time how we will operate.
It is always an issue, but can be even uglier if the event doesn't do well--like how far past "break even" on actual expenses (paper, supplies, vendor fee, etc) do you have to go before you start actually splitting money? (Example: if we agree that the cost of bringing the "setup" is $600/day, and we net $450 after all other expenses [before the equipment is taken into consideration]--the person saw a lot of money coming in, but doesn't get any of it...that can be a tough pill to swallow)
Another suggestion I've heard is: decide on a fixed percentage of the net that you will attribute to "the setup." That way even with a marginal event, everybody will walk away with something. That has pros and cons, too. Equipment holder still takes most of the risk on every event worked. And, of course, on a big lucrative event, partner may decide that it isn't fair to take that much money for the equipment...
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
A suggestion:
Make a list of the items you will require in order to do the event.
In a column next to each item, enter the purchase price.
In another column, enter the name of the partner who purchased that equipment.
Figure out each partner's invested total and figure out the percentage.
Subtract the actual COST of doing the event (fees, consumables, envelopes, meals, travel, etc.) and divide the rest according to the percentages invested.
Of course, what you don't want to hear is that if you're doing equal work, and you entered into the job together, you should split the proceeds evenly, regardless of who bought what, or brought what to the job.
My situation is that I have covered 100% of the cost of my gear, but I have a buddy who helps me at nearly every event I cover. I pay him as much as possible to keep him interested in helping me, but the lion's share of the income goes towards the gear the business requires. I take no salary; I figure the reward will come eventually. He doesn't expect or ask for an equal share, because he knows how much I have invested to make this business a reality. His hope is that after the equipment is paid for, we'll begin taking a more equal share.
Continuing this: if he had $4K worth of gear that he brought to each event, and I had $20K, I wouldn't try to take a bigger share of our earnings if we were doing equal work. That's why I'd prefer to keep things the way they are (my financial responsibility and him as PT labor) until my investment is fully recouped. Just some food for thought.
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
Thanks for chiming in. I was hoping you would! There are a couple of other big folks I'm hoping to hear from. For the other heavy hitters, if you're not keen on putting your business in the thread, please feel free to PM me or e-mail.
Your situation sounds much like mine. I actually took on a partner shortly before the merger was proposed. He understands that if it was a bust event there won't be much to spread around. He's getting more involved and is willing to put in the pre and post event time to make things happen.
Having all of the equipment makes the bookkeeping easier once we can iron out the rest of the bugs.
Copyright issues and post-event use of the images is another issue we have to deal with. I'm suggesting putting a moratorium (3-6 months) during which the partner should refrain from posting, for sale, the images from a given event. This would focus sales efforts on one site and should benefit everybody in the end.
Next we have to give a value to the "other skills" that a partner brings to the table.
To throw another wrinkle in--I'm currently the only one doing order fulfilling after the event.
How to split those proceeds is another bear. I'm thinking of keeping it separate and "contracting it out" to myself. We should be able to agree on a fair percentage of the order for providing that service (Printing cost, postage, plus time).
Whew, this is a simple merger--I can't imagine how the large corporations do it. [img]/ubbthreads/images/graemlins/confused.gif[/img]
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
First there are some things to consider
1) How well do you know this person and if its family run away(sorry couldn't help myself)
2) What are his work ethics ie. does he do what he sayes hes going to do
3) Is he a people person to me very important
4) Is he someone that you feel you can do business with(same feeling on money)
These are just a few things for you to fig out.but to be honest with you it sounds like you have allready figured out what you should do allready.(RIGHT)Just pay him a rate plus a small percent of profits (a bone if you will)For one thing I dont know if you have ever had a partner or not Its harder to find a good partner than a wife.I mean that hole hartedly.partnership is not to be taken lightly.Anyway I wish you all the luck in the world just dont sell yourself short just for an added hand.
Thanks Andy
White Balance so easy, even our 5 year old can do it.- Melissa Strickland
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