Fair-Market-Value of images?

[PaulClark]

Before we get into it, I am acutely aware of the sensitivity of the subject regarding selling all rights from a shoot.
I bid a on an advertising shoot that stipulated a total buyout of the selected images from the shoot. Frankly the
subject-matter rendered the images of limited market value outside of the clients interests.

Now to the nitty-gritty. I submitted a quote for ten shoots. Therefore the charge per shoot was much less than what
I would charge to do one shoot, for instance. The client stated that they were very happy with my work. The remaining
shoots never materialized. Since the client has changed the parameters as per the quote, then I will be billing accordingly.

What I'm looking to determine is: What is considered fair market value for fifteen images from the same
shoot (similar image with small variations) with a total buyout? Usage could be print: newspaper/magazine,
web, brochures, TV, panel adverts, etc.. Who knows? Not like they're going to give that up.

As I mentioned at the outset, I realize the idea of selling all rights is a sensitive issue, but I would hope to concentrate
on the issue of the worth of the fair market value of the images. Essentially I'm looking to charge the full fair
market value of the images (used for advertising purposes) since they have reneged on the previously agreed on terms.

I have looked at the price calculators, but think it would be more current and accurate to hear what others know the
value to be. Ballpark is fine (high end, low end).

My apologies for being somewhat vague, but this may end up in court.

Any help at all would be greatly appreciated.

[Leslie_BurnsDellAcqua]

Over $200K per image. And no, I'm not kidding. Someone (I wish I could remember who) actually spent the time to add up all the used in FotoQuote, assuming "middle values" in all cases. The total was over $200K.

Now, your client is going to hurl at those numbers and they are not project specific, but they do give you a starting point for your negotiations. Ask your client what theyr marketing budget is for all the uses for these images for the forseeable future--not how much they budgeted for the photography but how much the media buy, etc., will be. They will have this info, even if they say they don't. Then, take a percentage of that amount (2-5%) and multiply that number by the number of years you are granting unlimited usage.

If you are selling the images outright--that is doing a copyright transfer--then I suggest sticking to the $200K price. Remember, the woman who designed the Nike swoosh got a whole $35 for it--and how much is it worth? (ref: http://xroads.virginia.edu/~CLASS/am...r/nikhist.html )

You never know...

Unfortunately, all that being said, you could be in no position to negotiate anything beyond the original total. If you do not have it in your contract that any change in the contract parameters would result in renegotiation, then you may not be able to get anything more out of them than the original estimated total for the whole project.

As always, consult a lawyer to be sure.


Sorry you're going through this--
Leslie

[JohnHHarrington]

Paul --

There are numerous factors involved in "all rights", and I'm not going to get into all the "you shouldn't...you shoulda...etc" stuff. Further, there are factors of uniqueness, re-shootability, etc that I will leave out of this too.

There are photographers whom I have respect for from a business-sense perpective, that will license all rights in perpetuity for $30k per image. That does NOT include shoot expenses, etc, that's the price they would charge for the full license package.

That said, I have had rights packages with much more limited timing and uses for $24k for a single image, and the client felt comfortable with that figure.

I can say that I cannot remember a situation where a client said "do this one for me cheap, and I'll make the next worth your while..." EVER work out for me nor anyone I know. Further, if you're offerring a discount for quantity, you need to either get the larger package in writing, and include chargebacks when things get changed/cancelled, or allow for additional charges in your initial contract if X shoots don't occur within X months from the contracted shoot.

John

[Harold_Clark]

With regards to giving quantity discounts, this is what I do. I have been asked to price, say, ten shoots over a one year period on occasion. I offer a 10% discount, but here is how it works: The first nine shoots are at regular price, and the tenth one is free. Subsequent shoots are discounted 10%. When the year is up, the process repeats itself. In thirty years of business the ten shoots have never materialized. What they are really after is a volume discount without the volume.

[PaulClark]

Thanks to all for taking the time to give much appreciated advice.

Because the contact person worked for a large organization with whom I've enjoyed several excellent, professional relationships I was blind-sided by what happened. It's now clear to me that I'll have to draft up a document that will clarify things and provide protection for me in case things get dodgy...or rather to prevent that from happening in the first place.

[BillKoechling]

"It's now clear to me that I'll have to draft up a document that will clarify things and provide protection for me in case things get dodgy...or rather to prevent that from happening in the first place."

Yes...a hard-learned lesson. My contracts state:

"If client orders the performance of any services required to complete the above described assignment it constitutes an acceptance by conduct of this estimate in its entirety, whether signed by you or not."

In other words, you will be paying for the entire job, not bits & pieces.

You also stated, "the subject-matter rendered the images of limited market value outside of the clients interests."

Just remember that the images have value to the client - now and possibly later. If, for instance, the shoot was the client's products, there is certainly no value to anyone else but the client. These aren't going to become stock photos for you. But they do have value to the client. If their product line doesn't change much there should be more value per image than if they change products every 2 months. Just figure this stuff into your estimate. Don't, however, assume that something like this is worth $ 200K.

Good luck.

Bill K.

[PaulClark]

Thanks Bill. I like the the reference in your contract regarding "...acceptance...in its entirety...". A good idea that I shall work into the document.

You're also correct in the reasoning that the images are of value to the clients. The images are, in fact, "timeless" in many ways. That is to say the clothing, hair, and props do not lend themselves to be regarded as "trendy" or easily identified with a certain time period.


"The pessimist is the man who believes things couldn't possibly be worse, to which the optimist replies "Oh yes they could."
Vladimir Bukovsky